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2018 Indians thread

DSnyder15DSnyder15 Wealthy Alum
edited November 2017 in Paid to Play
Interesting read about Kipnis:

'http://waitingfornextyear.com/2017/11/on-trading-jason-kipnis/

I like Kipnis.  I hope he is stays and is healthy next year.
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Comments

  • DSnyder15DSnyder15 Wealthy Alum
    Free agents:

    Made qualifying offer to Santana  'http://www.cleveland.com/tribe/index.ssf/2017/11/cleveland_indians_carlos_santa_17.html

    Picked up options for Brantley and Tomlin  http://www.cleveland.com/tribe/index.ssf/2017/11/cleveland_indians_54.html

    Decline option on Boone Logan.
  • Re6H5wkRe6H5wk Wealthy Alum
    I'm glad they offered Santana; hope he takes it. Puzzled by the Brantley offer. Too much money (IMO) for a guy with uncertain status. Also, Zimmer, Chisenhall, and Guyer all coming off injuries as well. I'd rather target a FA for half the cost and who we know is healthy. They did quite well with Rajai and Jackson over the past two seasons.
  • DSnyder15DSnyder15 Wealthy Alum
    Re6H5wk said:

    I'm glad they offered Santana; hope he takes it. Puzzled by the Brantley offer. Too much money (IMO) for a guy with uncertain status. Also, Zimmer, Chisenhall, and Guyer all coming off injuries as well. I'd rather target a FA for half the cost and who we know is healthy. They did quite well with Rajai and Jackson over the past two seasons.

    If Brantley is healthy, 12M will be a bargain.  They could not get someone as good for 6M.  It may build some loyalty should they try and sign him to an extension.  But be honest....aren't you glad they are willing to spend the money to take that risk??

    I liked Rajai.  But he would not have helped that much last year as he did not have the same kind of year he had with the Indians.  The Indians seem to take flyers on quality individuals.  I like the Cleveland FO.

    I know Shaw gets ripped a lot but I think we will miss him.  He is a stand-up guy and a workhorse.  I hope he gets a shot to close for whoever he signs with.
  • Re6H5wkRe6H5wk Wealthy Alum
    I didn't mean to imply I wish they still had Davis. I just mean the FO has done a nice job these past few years. Brantley is high risk, high reward. I'm just not comfortable with this risk. And I think Shaw will be missed more than the casual fan realizes.
    DICK
  • DSnyder15DSnyder15 Wealthy Alum
    L:Brantley   C:Zimmer/Allen  R:Chisenhall/Guyer   Bench:Almonte

    If we are healthy....that is a good OF both offensively and defensively.  DH Brantley a day a week to give Encarnacion a day off and allow Encarnacion to avoid guys that are tough on him.

    Some big decisions will be about 2nd base, Kipnis, Diaz, Urshela and if Bruce gets signed....that will cause a ripple effect and force the FO to earn their money, 
  • Re6H5wkRe6H5wk Wealthy Alum
    That's a great OF, I agree. The "if we are healthy" part is what concerns me. I'd rather they had tried to re-sign Bruce than offer Brantley, though. We'll see. The guys in charge have shown they know what they're doing.
  • DSnyder15DSnyder15 Wealthy Alum
    This may be way off base...and I am sure Dick will disagree....but I have concerns about Ramirez log-term.  You may not remember but he played short for a while before Lindor.  When he was in spring training he would park his car in 2 spots (or 3 maybe...I forget).  They told him not to and finally the team got pissed and the veteran players moved his car to the infield...at short stop.  Was that all in fun??  He seems like a good guy....who knows.  Also...his frame reminds me a bit of Carlos Baerga (not such a good guy) and I worry that he may not age gracefully.  It would help if Urshela would learn to hit or Diaz would turn into Matt Williams defensively.  One thing is for sure....he was the MVP this last year and we would probably not have made the playoffs without him.  I just wish he had a good playoff...that would make me feel better.
  • Re6H5wkRe6H5wk Wealthy Alum
    They mess with JRam in the clubhouse all the time (see some of Bastian's articles), and he seems to have a good sense of humor about it.
  • Re6H5wkRe6H5wk Wealthy Alum
    Re6H5wk said:

    They mess with JRam in the clubhouse all the time (see some of Bastian's articles), and he seems to have a good sense of humor about it.

    https://bastian.mlblogs.com/covering-the-bases-game-151-d38ae64f1e8d
  • The_SackmanThe_Sackman Wealthy Alum
    Why would Santana take that?
  • Re6H5wkRe6H5wk Wealthy Alum

    Why would Santana take that?

    I'm hoping he will, but he could get a $100 million deal.
  • DSnyder15DSnyder15 Wealthy Alum
    Santana says he wants to play in Cleveland.  I think he does...just how much will be the key.  Santana ALWAYS starts slow.  We have been able to carry him and wait for him to produce.  I think that may cost him a little in free agency.  Now that he plays good in the field, I want him back.  Good defense, switch hitter, plays better at the end of year....count me in.  If he could learn to use the whole field I would like him all the more.  One question though....what is up with his sock look??
    Re6H5wkDICK
  • DICKDICK Wealthy Alum
    DSnyder15 said:

    This may be way off base...and I am sure Dick will disagree....but I have concerns about Ramirez log-term.  You may not remember but he played short for a while before Lindor.  When he was in spring training he would park his car in 2 spots (or 3 maybe...I forget).  They told him not to and finally the team got pissed and the veteran players moved his car to the infield...at short stop.  Was that all in fun??  He seems like a good guy....who knows.  Also...his frame reminds me a bit of Carlos Baerga (not such a good guy) and I worry that he may not age gracefully.  It would help if Urshela would learn to hit or Diaz would turn into Matt Williams defensively.  One thing is for sure....he was the MVP this last year and we would probably not have made the playoffs without him.  I just wish he had a good playoff...that would make me feel better.

    I cannot believe you are mentioning Urshela and Diaz in the same paragraph as Ramirez.  At no point in his career has Urshela given an indication that he has a major league third baseman's bat.  Diaz has some offensive potential, but so far does not have a major league ready defensive position.  These guys need some work just to establish themselves as major league players.  Ramirez, at 24, just finished in the top 3 in the AL MVP race, he is a tireless hustler and competitor and seems to get along great with everyone.  Come on Man!!  lol

    I am very worried about counting on either/both of Kipnis and Brantley, although I do agree with you that they are both great team guys and were tremendous leaders before back/neck/shoulder injuries slowed them down and hampered their games.  I think it is very risky to count on either one to ever be the player they were before the injuries.  I would rather have Bruce, Santana, and/or Shaw.  Those guys are still healthy and producing big time.
    DSnyder15
  • TruckCrewTruckCrew Wealthy Alum
    Santana declined the QO and has several teams, including the Indians, courting him.

    https://twitter.com/jonheyman/status/930442639890984965
  • TruckCrewTruckCrew Wealthy Alum
    Kluber takes home the Cy Young. A little surprised Scherzer won in the NL.
  • Re6H5wkRe6H5wk Wealthy Alum
    edited November 2017
    Hope Kluber enjoys that trophy when he thinks about how he helped cost the team a chance at some more important hardware.
  • TruckCrewTruckCrew Wealthy Alum
    Re6H5wk said:

    Hope Kluber enjoys that trophy when he thinks about how he helped cost the team a chance at some more important hardware.

    Ouch
  • DICKDICK Wealthy Alum
    Re6H5wk said:

    Hope Kluber enjoys that trophy when he thinks about how he helped cost the team a chance at some more important hardware.

    His back was hurting him, if you have never experienced that, you cannot understand.  It is not possible to perform physical activites at your normal level while your back is bothering you.  Just like Brantley and Kipnis and that Bengals TE.
    DSnyder15
  • Re6H5wk said:

    Hope Kluber enjoys that trophy when he thinks about how he helped cost the team a chance at some more important hardware.

    When he was pitcihing while hurt in the ALDS, you mean? Unless he held a gun to Francona’s head to get on the lineup card, I’m not sure what Kluber did wrong by insisting on playing.
    DSnyder15
  • Re6H5wkRe6H5wk Wealthy Alum
    edited November 2017
    If Kluber was hurt, he should have told Tito so they could have tried to make other arrangements. He must have known something was wrong after G2. Maybe I'm just frustrated that this franchise blew another series lead (and I don't really even count last year).
    DSnyder15
  • DSnyder15DSnyder15 Wealthy Alum
    My guess is that he did not think it was so bad..  Sometimes people think they can overcome and compensate for minor injuries....his back issues changed the slot or his delivery.  He gets a hall pass from me.  I wish that Tomlin had made that start rather than Bauer though...

  • Re6H5wkRe6H5wk Wealthy Alum
    At the time I was all for Bauer going on short rest considering what he did in G1. Plus, he claims he likes pitching on 3 days rest. In retrospect, it probably should have been Tomlin. Tbh, it shouldn't have even gone to a 4th game. Cookie pitched his butt off, and the offense crapped the bed.
    DSnyder15
  • The_SackmanThe_Sackman Wealthy Alum
    It wouldn't have mattered. You were inferior to the Yankees in every single way especially when it comes to fans on this board.
    DICK
  • Re6H5wkRe6H5wk Wealthy Alum

    It wouldn't have mattered. You were inferior to the Yankees in every single way especially when it comes to fans on this board.

    You/Alex may have a slight edge over myself/DSnyder. But the Indians were better in 2017 than the Yankees. Some good that did them.
    The_SackmanDSnyder15
  • DICKDICK Wealthy Alum
    Re6H5wk said:

    If Kluber was hurt, he should have told Tito so they could have tried to make other arrangements. He must have known something was wrong after G2. Maybe I'm just frustrated that this franchise blew another series lead (and I don't really even count last year).

    Back problems supposedly started in his last regular season start.  I think Francona did know, which is likely why Bauer was the surprise Game 1 starter.
  • TruckCrewTruckCrew Wealthy Alum
    Santana to the Phillies, or so say sources.

    3/$60M

    https://twitter.com/jonheyman/status/941737407635972096
  • DSnyder15DSnyder15 Wealthy Alum
    TruckCrew said:

    Santana to the Phillies, or so say sources.

    3/$60M

    https://twitter.com/jonheyman/status/941737407635972096

    More than we should pay.  Good luck...I hope he has a good time in Philly.
  • Re6H5wkRe6H5wk Wealthy Alum
    TruckCrew said:

    Santana to the Phillies, or so say sources.

    3/$60M

    https://twitter.com/jonheyman/status/941737407635972096

    That's the exact same contract the Indians gave Edwin I believe. I like Carlos, but he's not worth that $$.
  • Re6H5wkRe6H5wk Wealthy Alum
    DSnyder15 said:

    TruckCrew said:

    Santana to the Phillies, or so say sources.

    3/$60M

    https://twitter.com/jonheyman/status/941737407635972096

    More than we should pay.  Good luck...I hope he has a good time in Philly.
    This just shows you it was about the money for him (and I understand, it's a business). But why would you want to go from a team that's almost a lock to make the playoffs again and a fanbase that loves you, to a team that lost 96 games last year in a city with possibly the worst sports fans?
  • hawkattack06hawkattack06 Off-Campus Slummer
    Encarnacion and Santana have both averaged around 3 WAR over the last 7 years, so it makes sense they received similar deals. Also, the going rate for a win (above replacement) is about $7-9 million so I think both the contracts were good values.

    Santana has been undervalued his entire career. He doesn't jump out at you as great player, but he gets it done every single year. I think the Tribe will miss his consistency. I thought they should've resigned him for that price.
    TruckCrewDICK
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