Welcome to Miami Hawk Talk!

This website is a fan-operated and fan-oriented site primarily about athletics at Miami University in Oxford, Ohio.

This website is not affiliated with Miami University, the Mid-American Conference (MAC), the National Collegiate Hockey Conference (NCHC) the NCAA, or any other collegiate or professional organization.

It's name, image, and likeness day

245

Comments

  • profholt82profholt82 Wealthy Alum
    You fellas can spin this however you want, but this is bad news for Miami. The rich schools just got richer and the poor just got poorer. This will massively widen the gap between the P5 and mid-major schools. Heck, it will widen the gap between major P5 and lesser P5 schools. If college football wasn't already an oligopoly, this will make sure of it.

    And the NFL comparisons are off base. The NFL has a collective bargaining agreement, and rewards failure via the draft order and scheduling. Thereby maintaining as much parity as they can. This system will reward the schools with the most capital and market recognition while leaving the already poor schools to get poorer.

    And the guys who are naming famous Miami players, saying how much they would have benefitted from this. You're right, they would have. But not at Miami. At the school that had the most to offer financially.
    JCook32
  • Redskin89Redskin89 Havighurstite
    edited July 5
    Maybe I don’t understand how this all works but I am confused as to how this will hurt the small schools.  If I understand, the player can now profit off of their name, not the school-this benefits the student athlete.  For the people who say well now the big schools will get an advantage recruiting I don't think so.  Like Chuck said before OSU, that made a lot of people mad but he was right, the big schools basically get the first picks and the Group of 5 get the rest, with a few exceptions.  So, there maybe a few guys that might have come to a Group of 5 school that flips to a Power 5 school because of this, but in reality if the kid wasn’t that heavily recruited by Power 5 school he probably wont have a huge following that will pay him lots of money.  Again, maybe I just don’t understand all the inner workings but I don’t see how this will be the end of days for the small schools, won’t be the first time I was wrong and won’t be the last.
    Bash_Riprockagc
  • Bash_RiprockBash_Riprock Wealthy Alum

    You fellas can spin this however you want, but this is bad news for Miami. The rich schools just got richer and the poor just got poorer. This will massively widen the gap between the P5 and mid-major schools. Heck, it will widen the gap between major P5 and lesser P5 schools. If college football wasn't already an oligopoly, this will make sure of it.

    And the NFL comparisons are off base. The NFL has a collective bargaining agreement, and rewards failure via the draft order and scheduling. Thereby maintaining as much parity as they can. This system will reward the schools with the most capital and market recognition while leaving the already poor schools to get poorer.

    And the guys who are naming famous Miami players, saying how much they would have benefitted from this. You're right, they would have. But not at Miami. At the school that had the most to offer financially.

    I don't think you clearly understand the issue. This has very little to do with the schools. They will not be making money off of this. It's about student-athletes being able to protect and profit from their names, images, and likenesses and entering into sponsorship and endorsement contracts with for profit entities. The schools will not be involved other than allowing the student-athlete to use/wear the school's name and logo. Secondly, I guarantee 95% (probably even more) of student-athletes will not benefit from this regardless of the school they attend and play for. Do you really think the 3rd string right guard at Notre Dame is going to land a TV commercial contract selling cars for a South Bend auto dealer? Most of the student-athletes who will be taking an advantage of the NIL ruling (and rightfully so) will be monetizing their social media presence or brand, and it's not like any of them will be raking in millions. I'm simply baffled by the opposition to a student-athlete profiting from a blog or YouTube channel that he/she created, or performing as an artist under his/her real name. Apparently in some peoples' minds free enterprise is only for a select few.
    JCook32redhawk11skin66MacCrackenDICK
  • profholt82profholt82 Wealthy Alum
    It would seem easier to market oneself to business entities for commercial purposes (via tv ads, social media, or whatever) while playing football for a major school with grander reach and appeal than for a school such as Miami. But even when it comes to non-P5 schools, it would seem that schools in bigger markets would have an advantage over Miami as well. This move makes traditional incentives such as quality of school, coaches and facilities less important in the recruiting process than the ability for a player to make the most money. Perhaps in the future we'll see things such as business outreach departments forming within athletic departments to drum up more business for players in the hope of gaining a recruitment advantage.

    But you're right, Bash, at this point I don't clearly understand the issue. I'm sure the NCAA has a textbook of rules and regulations about it. And I don't have any statistics to back up my opinion like you guys, this is just my personal speculation based on the news of this development. I hope I'm way off, and this won't have a negative effect on Miami football in the future. And since I know so little about modern advertising when it comes to social media influencing and such, I probably am way off with my speculation.
  • agcagc Senior Barfly
    edited July 5
    Dalonte Brown (MBB) just posted on Facebook he was approached by a company. PS: I don't know how to upload images here, but I tried a free image hosting service:
    image
    profholt82Quinoaburger
  • agcagc Senior Barfly
    I guess folks are being a bit pessimistic here. We have a top 10 entrepreneurship program in the country, a top 40 business school, a loyal alumni base... In terms of recruiting, who is more likely to make some NIL money: Say, Dalonte Brown as Miami's first or second best player, or Dalonte Brown as Texas Tech 9th or 10th best player?
  • NickskinNickskin Wealthy Alum
    agc said:

    I guess folks are being a bit pessimistic here. We have a top 10 entrepreneurship program in the country, a top 40 business school, a loyal alumni base... In terms of recruiting, who is more likely to make some NIL money: Say, Dalonte Brown as Miami's first or second best player, or Dalonte Brown as Texas Tech 9th or 10th best player?

    …of course all those positives you’ve listed have had very little (if any) impact in Miami athletic attendance, interest, and fundraising over the past few decades.  
  • agcagc Senior Barfly
    edited July 5
    Nickskin said:

    agc said:

    I guess folks are being a bit pessimistic here. We have a top 10 entrepreneurship program in the country, a top 40 business school, a loyal alumni base... In terms of recruiting, who is more likely to make some NIL money: Say, Dalonte Brown as Miami's first or second best player, or Dalonte Brown as Texas Tech 9th or 10th best player?

    …of course all those positives you’ve listed have had very little (if any) impact in Miami athletic attendance, interest, and fundraising over the past few decades.  
    True. But I am talking about recruiting. Maybe it is me, but If I was a 16-18 years old kid, I would be thinking: how can this university help me go pro AND make some money now? Again, Farmer has tremendous entrepreneurship and marketing programs. I guess someone mentioned before here, and I agree with it: Athletics must collaborate with other divisions (or other divisions collaborate with Athletics). Business-wise, there are some many opportunities...  
    90skinprofholt82
  • DICKDICK Wealthy Alum
    Who are currently the best known Miami athletes??  I would say Dalonte Brown ( 4 year starter) in men's basketball, Brett Gabbert a 2 year starting QB who led us to a MAC championship, and Peyton Scott, women's basketball player who averaged 21ppg last season.   I can't think of a single high profile hockey player right now.  Other Miami athletes who might have some name recognition might include WR Jack Sorenson, men's basketball players Dae Dae Grant and Mekhi Lairy, baseball pitcher Sam Bachman, and softball pitcher Courtney Vierstra.  Even many of these athletes are not well known to everybody in Oxford.
    ChrisW1980
  • laxdaddylaxdaddy Senior Barfly
    DICK said:

    Who are currently the best known Miami athletes??  I would say Dalonte Brown ( 4 year starter) in men's basketball, Brett Gabbert a 2 year starting QB who led us to a MAC championship, and Peyton Scott, women's basketball player who averaged 21ppg last season.   I can't think of a single high profile hockey player right now.  Other Miami athletes who might have some name recognition might include WR Jack Sorenson, men's basketball players Dae Dae Grant and Mekhi Lairy, baseball pitcher Sam Bachman, and softball pitcher Courtney Vierstra.  Even many of these athletes are not well known to everybody in Oxford.

    Great points.

    A few years I was a guest lecturer for a couple classes at Miami.

    It was shortly before the NFL draft when Quentin Rollins was a senior. I had a picture of Q in his football uniform and told the students that he was about to be the highest paid member of the graduating class.

    I asked what his name was.

    Only one student in two classes knew who he was.

    DICK
  • elpalitoelpalito Wealthy Alum
    Davearama said:

    Bash...I do get it now. (I think!) Guess what I'm saying is that things like free academic help, access to trainers and docs and cash stipends have real value in addition to the room, board and tuition. Kind of like handing out Amazon cards as an undeclared added employee benefit.  

    As for Rickey Williams, I'd say his full ride scholarship and the extras mentioned above plus the opportunities he'll have after college, which 99.5% of the rest of his student body won't have are a very fair trade for what's he's doing as a scholarship athlete. Bet not many of his fellow grads mad million or two in first couple years after they graduated. What do you think?


    Let me make this a bit personal. I've mentioned before I've got a nephew who's full ride f/b player at UC. He's torched both knees in non contact team drills. Team docs have told him his run as a linebacker is over. Trying to gain 50+ lbs to play defensive end for last season or two not in the cards. So he got medicaled and UC will honor his full five years. He's good student and great kid and will wind up getting his MBA in five thanks to football. This summer he's got a dream internship because of f/b and will probably have a fabulous job opportunity when he's done. All things said I think he's gotten a good deal for his scholarship and if you were to ask him I doubt he'd say he has been taken advantage of no matter what the coach makes. 

    And yes....I do think of college athletes as amateurs and pros as well...pros. Just having been a scholarship athlete and a parent who's paid for three kids thru college I have a true understanding of what a scholarship is worth and think that's enough. Maybe it's generational, don't know. 










    The way things are explained as to why America is better is that you get paid for the work you put in.  Rickey Williams brought in far, far, far more money than Texas ever had to shell out to him.  Scholarships..tutors... that's peanuts. 

    The NIL thing will be beneficial to elite players and other marketable players if you're only thinking about endorsements and promoting used cars.  It will give all players a chance to make money without being penalized when you consider side hustles and the like. 

     
    Bash_Riprock
  • hawkattack06hawkattack06 Senior Barfly
    This is a good change. Let the free market decide what these players should be paid.

    I guess it could widen the gap between the haves and have nots, but the reality is the gap can’t get much wider.
  • Professor_FateProfessor_Fate Wealthy Alum
    edited July 6
    If Miami really is J Crew U, then I can see that clothing line signing Miami’s athletes to deals. Probably should even put J Crew logo in the end zones, on the basketball court, on the warmup circles, and on the ice behind the nets.
  • skinsskins Wealthy Alum
    see if GPAs take a huge dip...
  • redhawk11redhawk11 Wealthy Alum
    skins said:

    see if GPAs take a huge dip...

    Do GPAs take a dip for the students who work in the food halls?

    JCook32Bash_RiprockDICK
  • NickskinNickskin Wealthy Alum
    agc said:

    Nickskin said:

    agc said:

    I guess folks are being a bit pessimistic here. We have a top 10 entrepreneurship program in the country, a top 40 business school, a loyal alumni base... In terms of recruiting, who is more likely to make some NIL money: Say, Dalonte Brown as Miami's first or second best player, or Dalonte Brown as Texas Tech 9th or 10th best player?

    …of course all those positives you’ve listed have had very little (if any) impact in Miami athletic attendance, interest, and fundraising over the past few decades.  
    True. But I am talking about recruiting. Maybe it is me, but If I was a 16-18 years old kid, I would be thinking: how can this university help me go pro AND make some money now? Again, Farmer has tremendous entrepreneurship and marketing programs. I guess someone mentioned before here, and I agree with it: Athletics must collaborate with other divisions (or other divisions collaborate with Athletics). Business-wise, there are some many opportunities...  
    no doubt.  I read the tweet sent out by Miami embracing this new era and touting current CEO's, companies founded/run by Miami grads and business school accolades.  HOWEVER, will Miami approach this with the same [sarcasm]GUSTO[/sarcasm] its approached everything involving athletics OR will it really try to make meaningful connections between biz school/grads/companies and current athletes?
    agcProfessor_FateDICK
  • QuinoaburgerQuinoaburger Wealthy Alum
    redhawk11 said:

    skins said:

    see if GPAs take a huge dip...

    Do GPAs take a dip for the students who work in the food halls?

    I mean, they do, but we wouldn't use that as a justification to ban students from working in dining halls just like we shouldn't ban athletes from being able to make money off of their own names.
    agcredhawk11Bash_RiprockJCook32
  • Spanks004Spanks004 Wealthy Alum
    While I agree this can hurt us against the P5s, I do feel Miami is in a great place to distance ourselves from other MAC schools. Miami still has a name that the Akron’s, Kent’s, even BG don’t have. I know they aren’t making money off the school, but we all know brands are still looking at that players reach so it is important.
  • MUHawk84MUHawk84 Wealthy Alum
    Nickskin said:

    agc said:

    Nickskin said:

    agc said:

    I guess folks are being a bit pessimistic here. We have a top 10 entrepreneurship program in the country, a top 40 business school, a loyal alumni base... In terms of recruiting, who is more likely to make some NIL money: Say, Dalonte Brown as Miami's first or second best player, or Dalonte Brown as Texas Tech 9th or 10th best player?

    …of course all those positives you’ve listed have had very little (if any) impact in Miami athletic attendance, interest, and fundraising over the past few decades.  
    True. But I am talking about recruiting. Maybe it is me, but If I was a 16-18 years old kid, I would be thinking: how can this university help me go pro AND make some money now? Again, Farmer has tremendous entrepreneurship and marketing programs. I guess someone mentioned before here, and I agree with it: Athletics must collaborate with other divisions (or other divisions collaborate with Athletics). Business-wise, there are some many opportunities...  
    no doubt.  I read the tweet sent out by Miami embracing this new era and touting current CEO's, companies founded/run by Miami grads and business school accolades.  HOWEVER, will Miami approach this with the same [sarcasm]GUSTO[/sarcasm] its approached everything involving athletics OR will it really try to make meaningful connections between biz school/grads/companies and current athletes?
    What is Option A, for $1809?
  • DavearamaDavearama Havighurstite
    Ah hell, this isn't going to wind up being a lot different than good old old fashioned under the table payments only now they're going to be legal. Give a kid a "job", put them on the payroll and pay them whatever you want. 

    Hand them $200 and take their picture. Tell them and everyone you were going to use them in your next Instagram campaign. 

    Thing is that used to be illegal. Of course I graduated a Red something?.. so times change, names change and what's legal changes. Guess I have to get over it. 

    Still think a scholarship worth $40K (per year) plus extras was more than enough for a college kiddie. Add on the opportunity to showcase your skills in front of national TV audiences and use that to potentially make 10x-20x-30x more than your fellow grads right out of school is a pretty fair deal. 

    Here we go.... The Starting Fab Five Offensive Lineman at Miami University, Oxford, Ohio,---Home of the REDHAWKS!!! BROUGHT TO YOU BY YOUR UPTOWN SKYLINE CHILE!!!

    "Starting at left tackle, weight in at 322 pounds and a HUGE FAN of Extra LARGE FIVE WAYS and extra hot sauce!!!! (excited voice!) Mike McWilliams. 


    agcDICK
  • DavearamaDavearama Havighurstite
    One more thought on Power 5 schools and them helping athletes get NIL deals. Bet there's already slots being made in the athletic department's budgets nationwide to add someone(s) to help bring in NIL deals to the school's athletes.

    I don't know, but personally my tax dollars going to Ohio State and their Athletic Departments $233.9 million dollar athletic 
     budget to help pay for someone to help their kiddies get more/better/bigger NIL deals kind of makes me ill. 
  • elpalitoelpalito Wealthy Alum
    A 40k scholarship would be enough if amateurism actually existed and no one had to pay to go see a football game or other sporting event.  But since it's a ridiculous money maker, then the players should be able to get whatever piece of the pie they can.
    grumpy1Bash_Riprockredhawk11Love_and_Honor
  • JCook32JCook32 Dodds God
    I don't know if you quite understand what NIL does for the student athletes. If Miami wins the conference and one of the players designs an awesome shirt celebrating the accomplishment, they can sell those shirts. If a company wants an athlete to put up a sponsored social media post, they can make a few bucks. If a local radio show wants to have a player make a weekly appearance on the show, what harm is there if they get a check for their time? I don't know how to format so just kinda bear with me on the below.

    "Ah hell, this isn't going to wind up being a lot different than good old
    old fashioned under the table payments only now they're going to be
    legal. Give a kid a "job", put them on the payroll and pay them whatever
    you want." - Since, for the time being, this is state regulated, I'm not exactly sure what the rules are in place in Ohio. But most other states have put in clauses that services must be exchanged for payment. And if there's no services provided, then it's an NCAA violation. OpenDorse, a company that's helping manage student-athlete deals has built a dashboard where the student-athlete and company can manage the terms of the agreement and make sure both sides fulfill their commitments in a trackable way.

    Hand them $200 and take their picture. Tell them and everyone you were going to use them in your next Instagram campaign.  - Ok, so? We're upset about a picture on social media?

    Thing is that used to be illegal. Of course I graduated a Red
    something?.. so times change, names change and what's legal changes.
    Guess I have to get over it. - Yes, things change.

    Still think a scholarship worth $40K (per year) plus extras was more
    than enough for a college kiddie. Add on the opportunity to showcase
    your skills in front of national TV audiences and use that to
    potentially make 10x-20x-30x more than your fellow grads right out of
    school is a pretty fair deal. - I don't agree but I won't argue with you. The thing is...the school is still providing the scholarship for $40k (per year) plus extras (?). The schools are providing no more than what they were providing on June 30th. School still getting a really great deal where they have to offer nothing but the bare minimum to get an athlete to generate large sums of money for them.

    "Here we go.... The Starting Fab Five Offensive Lineman at Miami
    University, Oxford, Ohio,---Home of the REDHAWKS!!! BROUGHT TO YOU BY
    YOUR UPTOWN SKYLINE CHILE!!!" - This has nothing to do with NIL. This would be a sponsorship deal with the University athletic department. Which they already do. I haven't seen anyone object to the school selling sponsorships to make money.

    "Starting at left tackle, weight in at 322 pounds and a HUGE FAN of
    Extra LARGE FIVE WAYS and extra hot sauce!!!! (excited voice!) Mike
    McWilliams." - Do they do this in the pros? When they announce starting lineups, they talk about the player's sponsorships?

    One more thought on Power 5 schools and them helping athletes get NIL
    deals. Bet there's already slots being made in the athletic department's
    budgets nationwide to add someone(s) to help bring in NIL deals to the
    school's athletes. - I hope Miami is doing this, for sure. But it is a bit of a competing interest to the University.

    I don't know, but personally my tax dollars going to Ohio State and their Athletic Departments $233.9 million dollar athletic 
     budget to help pay for someone to help their kiddies get more/better/bigger NIL deals kind of makes me ill. - That is your opinion and I will respect it.
    Bash_Riprockagchawkattack06
  • The_SackmanThe_Sackman Wealthy Alum
    Cameo has been flooded with college athletes this week. This is waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay more likely (hopefully not OnlyFans!) than whatever horror stories everyone else is concocting.
    Bash_RiprockQuinoaburgerthechuck_2112redhawk11Love_and_HonorChrisW1980
  • Bash_RiprockBash_Riprock Wealthy Alum
    Davearama said:

    Still think a scholarship worth $40K (per year) plus extras was more than enough for a college kiddie. Add on the opportunity to showcase your skills in front of national TV audiences and use that to potentially make 10x-20x-30x more than your fellow grads right out of school is a pretty fair deal. 


    You should really take the time and listen to the interview with the University of Coral Gables QB who talks about the large number of his teammates who send their monthly stipend home to help their family. Do that and your views on the topic might be less myopic.
  • Bash_RiprockBash_Riprock Wealthy Alum
    Davearama said:

     Maybe it's generational, don't know. 


    I mean, you could have just said "Get the hell off my lawn".
    redhawk11DICK
  • MooreHawkMooreHawk Senior Barfly
    edited July 7
    Cameo has been flooded with college athletes this week. This is waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay more likely (hopefully not OnlyFans!) than whatever horror stories everyone else is concocting.


    "
    Can a college athlete set up an OnlyFans now? Probably. SHOULD they? Probably not." - 

  • BluesmanBluesman Wealthy Alum
    One would hope all athletes at Miami, men and women, from football to track and every other sport, is getting support, guidance and assistance from the AD's office and in conjunction with Farmer School of Business. If not, the athletes are not getting the support they need and Miami is losing out on huge recruiting opportunities. 
    JCook32
  • RedseaRedsea Wealthy Alum
    Bluesman said:

    One would hope all athletes at Miami, men and women, from football to track and every other sport, is getting support, guidance and assistance from the AD's office and in conjunction with Farmer School of Business. If not, the athletes are not getting the support they need and Miami is losing out on huge recruiting opportunities. 

    Why would the business school be involved. Shouldnt the business school be worried about making money for the students in the business school?
    Redskin89Bash_Riprockredhawk11
  • thechuck_2112thechuck_2112 Wealthy Alum
    Redsea said:

    Bluesman said:

    One would hope all athletes at Miami, men and women, from football to track and every other sport, is getting support, guidance and assistance from the AD's office and in conjunction with Farmer School of Business. If not, the athletes are not getting the support they need and Miami is losing out on huge recruiting opportunities. 

    Why would the business school be involved. Shouldnt the business school be worried about making money for the students in the business school?
    Yeah,I feel like the business school has more important things to do than serve as an appendage of athlete self-marketing. The athletic department should be providing support on that front if athletes want it, but the business school should focus on business students. 
    Bash_Riprock
Sign In or Register to comment.